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Post by ML Fan on May 2, 2010 15:12:01 GMT -5
Agree 100% -- it's like we have NCIS-a and NCIS-b. With both USA and ION showing NCIS reruns dozens of times each week, I have both on fairly frequently, and am far likely to actually stop and watch episodes from S3-S6 than from S1 or S2. Those first 2 years had a different team, different sense of humor, different show over all. Of course I watch for MW and to try to catch canon I may have ignored the first 20 times I saw an ep  but I bet had they not had made the drastic change that they did by losing a team member before S3 that they would not have made it to S7 and the upcoming S8. I only started watching regularly around the time they replaced Kate with Ziva and then caught up with the first couple seasons on USA. Honestly aside from those two characters I don't see a big difference. Some eps have more humor than others, some eps focus more on one character or another  pretty much how it is now IMO. They do seem to do more multi episode stories as the series moves on and those multi ep stories tend to be more serious eps so I guess that's what everyone is talking about? I would say that after Season 2 that there was a lot less of idea of being a woman in a male oriented job being part of the show in one or another and that we've learned more about the character's pasts and what has made them who they are today, which is something I really don't think we would've seen with DPB still running "NCIS." |
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Post by mari on May 2, 2010 17:09:39 GMT -5
I would say that after Season 2 that there was a lot less of idea of being a woman in a male oriented job being part of the show in one or another and that we've learned more about the character's pasts and what has made them who they are today, which is something I really don't think we would've seen with DPB still running "NCIS." I agree with you on the second part, the show after S2 more exploring the past, trying to make the characters more multi-leveled... which did work for me but sometimes went over the top... Or rather the way they did it, with their use of blurry flashbacks and drama. But never perceived the seasons with Kate as 'female proving herself in a male job'...  (And I normally consider myself (over-)sensitive for that, growing up with traditional gender ideas and now working in 90 % male job environment  )... to me she just seemed to fit the team less as a character? |
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Post by ML Fan on May 2, 2010 21:01:20 GMT -5
I would say that after Season 2 that there was a lot less of idea of being a woman in a male oriented job being part of the show in one or another and that we've learned more about the character's pasts and what has made them who they are today, which is something I really don't think we would've seen with DPB still running "NCIS." I agree with you on the second part, the show after S2 more exploring the past, trying to make the characters more multi-leveled... which did work for me but sometimes went over the top... Or rather the way they did it, with their use of blurry flashbacks and drama. But never perceived the seasons with Kate as 'female proving herself in a male job'... (And I normally consider myself (over-)sensitive for that, growing up with traditional gender ideas and now working in 90 % male job environment )... to me she just seemed to fit the team less as a character? I think that Kate was a great character on paper but, more often than she was the one who made some sort of error losing her gun, misreading a potential suspect etc., it got to the point with me that if something went wrong during the first two seasons that in some way Kate was somehow going to be the one who was going to be put in a less than positive light. I thought that the writers made a big deal of Kate's previous job crendentials and Kate being a woman in her job, but, that her character was never really given much to do. To me she was written like a stereotypical career woman where it was all work and no real hint of a personal life. I also thought that Tony, Kate and McGee were like three children who constantly wanted the approval and attention of Gibbs and that was overdone to me and so I was glad that this stopped for the most part after Season 2. |
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Post by AngelZ on May 4, 2010 0:13:54 GMT -5
I think it's borderline ridiculous to even both trying to compare the first 2 seasons of the show with say the last 2. On one hand you have a brand new show trying to prove itself and on the other side a 7 year old top rating show attempting to prove that it it's still fresh and hasn't worn out it's welcome. Our expectations of TV and how shows are made and watched has also changed dramatically in the last 7 years.
The same goes for trying to make comparisons between Ziva and Kate. I think I've only ever seen one or two episodes of JAG but I am going to make the assumption that the character of Kate was similar to the lead female in that show. Smart, experienced, confident, not too left field and at the end of the day played second fiddle to the main boys? A character for the times. My personal belief is that a character like Ziva wouldn't have worked in the first few seasons of NCIS. It would have been too much. Back then the main team was fairly straight and it was the 2 support acts (Abby and Ducky) that were the nutters. MW's natural nuttiness emerged pretty quickly in the character of Tony but I don't think that was the original plan. Over 7 years the show has changed and the characters have too.
Looking back I think I/we were too harsh on Kate. When Tony mucked up it was cute, when Kate mucked up she was considered incompetent. I didn't watch the show to see Kate, I watched for Tony so it was easy to read everything she did wrong in a 'glass in half empty' kind of way. I don't love the character of Ziva as I once did. The things that once intrigued me don't have that spark any more. Who knows, maybe if Kate had have been around for 5 seasons I'd have grown to like her more?
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but I bet had they not had made the drastic change that they did by losing a team member before S3 that they would not have made it to S7 and the upcoming S8.
pretty much how it is now IMO. They do seem to do more multi episode stories as the series moves on and those multi ep stories tend to be more serious eps so I guess that's what everyone is talking about? 
(And I normally consider myself (over-)sensitive for that, growing up with traditional gender ideas and now working in 90 % male job environment 
)... to me she just seemed to fit the team less as a character? 