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Post by ML Fan on Feb 27, 2010 21:05:42 GMT -5
Have you seen "Mother's Day?" Tell us what you thought.
There are spoilers and discussions also on our sister site NCIS Special Ops, if you're interested.
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Post by shywriter on Mar 2, 2010 21:26:52 GMT -5
Have you seen "Mother's Day?" Tell us what you thought. There are spoilers and discussions also on our sister site NCIS Special Ops, if you're interested. So let me be the first to say .... SPOILER>SPOILER>SPOILER>SPOILER>....WTF? I'll think about the rest later but those last minutes ... !!! -- big enough that Gibbs just put himself in position to be canned for what he did... but WHY did Vance cover/play into it? Looking at his expressions, he knew what was up; I'm convinced of it. So who filled him in and why is he allowing Gibbs to let a murderer go? I'll buy that Gibbs did what he did, but I was waiting for a whole arc on his losing his job, etc... Vance would NOT let him off the hook, but Vance knew what happened. Does.not.compute... |
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Post by Mr.Clark on Mar 3, 2010 15:47:40 GMT -5
I'll think about the rest later but those last minutes ... !!! -- big enough that Gibbs just put himself in position to be canned for what he did... but WHY did Vance cover/play into it? Looking at his expressions, he knew what was up; I'm convinced of it. So who filled him in and why is he allowing Gibbs to let a murderer go? I'll buy that Gibbs did what he did, but I was waiting for a whole arc on his losing his job, etc... Vance would NOT let him off the hook, but Vance knew what happened. Does.not.compute...Vance seems like the type that would be willing to keep blackmail material like that in his back pocket. Especially when the murder was in the moral grey zone in terms of justification. Its also possible that we haven't seen the fallout and that it may be coming next week. |
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Post by dzero on Mar 3, 2010 17:49:27 GMT -5
I'll buy that Gibbs did what he did, but I was waiting for a whole arc on his losing his job, etc... Unfortunately I wasn't waiting for that arc, no way the writers would have the guts. They should have saved this storyline for the end of the show when Gibbs retires/is fired and hands the team off to Tony. LOL you know it's bad when that lawyer chick isn't the worst thing in the ep ;D no offense to lawyer chicks  |
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Post by AngelZ on Mar 3, 2010 18:04:01 GMT -5
I think I have developed the ability to overlook most of the stupidity and WTF storylines that rear their ugly heads on this show (and most shows on tv for that matter). I think that's the reason why I enjoy SciFi. Stupidity and crazy storylines are a given. Science that doesn't quite make sense is ok. People do crazy things either because their downright evil or because they've been infected by an alien mind altering bug.  Wish I could have gone with Tony to the Kurosawa film festival  |
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Post by Mr.Clark on Mar 3, 2010 18:04:24 GMT -5
I'll buy that Gibbs did what he did, but I was waiting for a whole arc on his losing his job, etc... Unfortunately I wasn't waiting for that arc, now way the writers would have the guts. They should have saved this storyline for the end of the show when Gibbs retires/is fired and hands the team off to Tony. LOL you know it's bad when that lawyer chick isn't the worst thing in the ep ;D no offense to lawyer chicks Now that Mark Harmon is a producer I think the show will probably be canceled before he walks away from it. Yet anothor aspect of sacrifices the writers make that drives me bonkers. Quite frankly the guy should be retiring soon, he was a Gunnie in the Corps so thats probably close to ten years in service plus hes now coming up on 20 with NCIS. His character would have to be close to or over 50, one would think that a job like his would have something akin to mandatory retirement age. |
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Post by shywriter on Mar 4, 2010 14:49:18 GMT -5
Vance seems like the type that would be willing to keep blackmail material like that in his back pocket. Especially when the murder was in the moral grey zone in terms of justification. Its also possible that we haven't seen the fallout and that it may be coming next week. Blackmail material, yes, some; smaller stuff -- but not this big. This is huge. I mean, REALLY bad, not getting off the hook bad. Bad enough that Vance would be fired if anyone caught wind that he knew of it and didn't take immediate action. Why would he need "blackmail" so badly against Gibbs that he would risk his own career for it? After all-- he's not only a by the book agent but a family man, with two young kids who need braces and college. If it was blackmailing the SecNav, a Senator, etc -- I still don't see it in Vance, but it would at least make sense if he had something against someone Big. Gibbs, though Gibbs, is small fry. (Doesn't even matter that the writers gave the wrong implication -- MIL could still be prosecuted; only the confession is tainted.) Not only is it a major issue when law enforcement plays with a case like that, would think that any employer (SecNav?) would bounce any employee acting so rashly in opposition to his job and its purpose. And "moral grey zone" doesn't affect the prosecution either, doesn't fit within the usual mitigating circumstances -- sudden heat, defense of self or others, etc -- whether or not we want to say we understand, it was decades before, and "eye for an eye" is not written into any US legal system (although there are still parts of the country in which, sad to say, the "he needed killin'" defense still has some traction).No-- Gibbs and Vance and the team all know damn well her arrest was completely called for-- and, actually, was completely lawful based on the forensics. They would have just tried her without any mention of her statements to Gibbs. The law usually does allow for a true "moral grey zone" (again, self defense, etc) and this is not one that is condoned in the system. Even if you're Gibbs M-I-L. I think I have developed the ability to overlook most of the stupidity and WTF storylines that rear their ugly heads on this show (and most shows on tv for that matter). Yeah, but you know how sometimes there's a line, and you may allow the line to be waaaaay out there, but if they cross it, it's just more than you can accept? This one made it for me. Can you tell?  (and funny thing, I watched the ep again later that night and I liked it just fine until the ending.  ) |
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Post by dzero on Mar 5, 2010 1:31:04 GMT -5
I think that's the reason why I enjoy SciFi. Stupidity and crazy storylines are a given. Science that doesn't quite make sense is ok. People do crazy things either because their downright evil or because they've been infected by an alien mind altering bug. Gaius Baltar craziest mofo in TV history  Seven Samurai is truly awesome , haven't seen Hidden Fortress  |
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Post by dzero on Mar 5, 2010 1:38:45 GMT -5
They would have just tried her without any mention of her statements to Gibbs. OK, I only watched once and I'm not going to watch again so no one give me "you have to rewatch it" as an answer ;D But I'm confused as to how it was illegal for Gibbs to question the Mother in Law. He was talking to the lawyer who at first told him not to interview the MIL but didn't she then relent and say "well it's up to her" meaning up to the Mother in Law and then they cut right to the two of them talking casually which to me implies her consent. |
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Post by shywriter on Mar 5, 2010 20:06:40 GMT -5
But I'm confused as to how it was illegal for Gibbs to question the Mother in Law. He was talking to the lawyer who at first told him not to interview the MIL but didn't she then relent and say "well it's up to her" meaning up to the Mother in Law and then they cut right to the two of them talking casually which to me implies her consent. Excellent point; IMHO, you're "confused" because you're probably right -- or, more likely, if this was at a suppression hearing, a judge might well agree with you -- or might not. All sorts of issues can be argued -- she's represented but she never asked for a lawyer; she decided to talk without her lawyer present but never clearly waived her right to counsel; all sorts of smaller side issues from that could be in play. But even more to the point, it's doubtful that it was a custodial interrogation. As long as she was free to go at any time (and that would have been true in an interrogation room -- this was his basement!) it should be admissible. However, that could be argued both ways. (And it wasn't coerced; M. Hart was just blowin' smoke. Now, THAT -- a lawyer making stuff up on the spur of the moment --THAT was realistic! ;D) But the reason I was hopping up & down about the other stuff is that, unlike the above issues, it's not debatable that if Gibbs intentionally prevented her prosecution, then it's game over for Gibbs. If Vance condoned it, he's out, too. These are the most egregious legal errors I remember seeing them make, but what's worse, this is way past Gibbs turning the other way or bending the law as he has before. I was pretty stunned when he switched DNA samples for the kidney donor -- but that was fairly mild compared to this. Phew. |
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Post by ML Fan on Mar 6, 2010 12:18:36 GMT -5
I know that Vance seems to be the kind of person who would use what happened as blackmail material later on at some point, but, I don't think that anything will really come out of this situation because, Gibbs is the one running the show figuratively and literally in this case. I've always thought that both Jenny's and now Vance's hands are tied when it comes to Gibbs and his and his conduct and was I surprised about Vance simply brushing the murder under a rug? No, not one bit. I also knew that as soon as Gibbs called in M. Hart that Gibbs was going to do as much as he could to let his ex-mother-in-law get away with the murder and so he used M. Hart to get exactly what he wanted.
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Post by AngelZ on Mar 6, 2010 17:04:10 GMT -5
I too will unlikely be rewatching the ep so apologies if I've missed a crutial point here -but does anyone else have a problem with the other drug trafficker/military guy being framed for murder? It's bad enough to ignore the evidence against Gibb's MIL but then to also re-direct the evidence to point at someone else! Yeah the guy is a bad nut but he should be tried for his actual crimes not another one that you're trying to cover up.
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Post by AngelZ on Mar 6, 2010 17:16:04 GMT -5
This one made it for me. Can you tell? (and funny thing, I watched the ep again later that night and I liked it just fine until the ending. ) After mulling over this ep for a while I think I have to agree. They/he has definately jumped the line this time. There isn't any grey at all. |
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